Re: Mexican Border

["Arturo Ramos" <arturo.ramos2@...>]

I have noticed children taking on maternal names when land titles 
were associated with the maternal line... i.e. the child's maternal 
grandfather was a big landowner and so the child took on the name 
that went with the land (and prestige presumably).

Emilie, Tlaltenango is the main city in the valley that constitutes 
the "southern arm" of Zacatecas that is trapped between 
Aguascalientes and Jalisco.  It was the alcaldia for what is now 
Totatiche, Atolinga, Tepechitlan, Mezquital del Oro, etc.

I have both Talamantes and Avilas interspersed in my genealogy, also 
from Tlaltenango.

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" <auntyemfaustus@h...> 
wrote:
>
> 
>     "The original founding families of Culver City, 
>     California, for example were the Talamantes and Avila from 
>     Aguascalientes... probably related to some people in the group".
> 
> Yes Arturo,
> 
> There is a Talamantes from Taltenango (where is that? I can't find 
it in a map) in my husband's lines in the Jalisco records, but his 
son did not take on his surname.  He took on his mother's surname, 
Cervantes.  Do you think he did that because his Talamantes father 
was indigenous (his father's mother was surnamed Diegina), and it 
would bode him better if he were known as a Cervantes?  Especially if 
he looked espanol as my husband does?  I notice that trend (to take 
the mother's surname) among the children of many Espanolas who 
married Indian men with or without surnames.  Their races were not 
noted since this was in 1839 in Encarnacion de Diaz.    
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA --
> 
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: Arturo Ramos<mailto:arturo.ramos2@v...> 
>   To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com<mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com> 
>   Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 8:24 AM
>   Subject: [ranchos] Re: Mexican Border
> 
> 
>   Ed/Angie:
> 
>   Whatever the political status of the American Southwest was 
>   throughout the 1700s and early 1800s, it was if not indigenous in 
>   identity, certainly Mexican.  Most of the settlers in the area 
were 
>   not Spaniards, as a lot of Anglo revisionist historians like to 
>   purport by glorifying the missions, etc., but Mexicans... 
Tlaxacaltec 
>   colonizers in New Mexico, immigrants from Sonora, Chihuahua, 
>   Aguascalientes, etc... The original founding families of Culver 
City, 
>   California, for example were the Talamantes and Avila from 
>   Aguascalientes... probably related to some people in the group.
> 
>   The following book is very well researched and provides a whole 
new 
>   insight into the attempted "de-Mexicanization" of Los Angeles.  A 
>   very good read.
> 
>   Whitewashed Adobe : The Rise of Los Angeles and the Remaking of 
Its 
>   Mexican Past
>   by William Deverell
> 
>   Review:
> 
>   Chronicling the rise of Los Angeles through shifting ideas of 
race 
>   and ethnicity, William Deverell offers a unique perspective on 
how 
>   the city grew and changed. Whitewashed Adobe considers six 
different 
>   developments in the history of the city--including the cementing 
of 
>   the Los Angeles River, the outbreak of bubonic plague in 1924, 
and 
>   the evolution of America's largest brickyard in the 1920s. In an 
>   absorbing narrative supported by a number of previously 
unpublished 
>   period photographs, Deverell shows how a city that was once part 
of 
>   Mexico itself came of age through appropriating--and even 
>   obliterating--the region's connections to Mexican places and 
people. 
>   Deverell portrays Los Angeles during the 1850s as a city seething 
>   with racial enmity due to the recent war with Mexico. He explains 
>   how, within a generation, the city's business interests, looking 
for 
>   a commercially viable way to establish urban identity, borrowed 
>   Mexican cultural traditions and put on a carnival called La 
Fiesta de 
>   Los Angeles. He analyzes the subtle ways in which ethnicity came 
to 
>   bear on efforts to corral the unpredictable Los Angeles River and 
>   shows how the resident Mexican population was put to work 
fashioning 
>   the modern metropolis. He discusses how Los Angeles responded to 
the 
>   nation's last major outbreak of bubonic plague and concludes by 
>   considering the Mission Play, a famed drama tied to regional 
>   assumptions about history, progress, and ethnicity. Taking all of 
>   these elements into consideration, Whitewashed Adobe uncovers an 
>   urban identity--and the power structure that fostered it--with 
far-
>   reaching implications for contemporary Los Angeles.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "aajay1073" <aajay1073@y...> 
wrote:
>   >
>   > Ed,
>   > 
>   > Sorry...I have a tendecy to simplfy things and generalize...  I 
>   fully 
>   > understand what you mean.
>   > 
>   > Thanks,
>   > Angie
>   > 
>   > --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Edward Serros" <ed@s...> wrote:
>   > >
>   > > Angie,
>   > > 
>   > > As a point of clarification, the independent country of 
Mexico 
>   > owned much of the 
>   > > Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to 
~1848). 
>   > Spain owned the 
>   > > Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is 
that 
>   I 
>   > hear the statement that 
>   > > Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people 
>   > remember the dates well or 
>   > > fully understand the entities involved.
>   > > 
>   > > 
>   > > Ed
>   > >
>   >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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