Re: [ranchos] Juan v. Juan Jose v. Jose Francisco

[jose munoz <jmunoz2781@...>]

I agree

Been there...done that on many occassion.  

Heard years ago priests, in late 1700's,  scripted
"Jose and/or Maria" to distinguish gender.
What say you?

Jose Munoz
Yuba City, Ca.





--- Emilie Garcia <auntyemfaustus@...> wrote:

> Joseph,
> 
> After many years of searching the IGI and
> microfilms, I think that everyone in Mexico was
> named Jose or Maria, or Jose Maria, or Juan, since I
> run into the same things you have.  It seems that
> the priests would also often abbreviate these three
> common names.  Juan was often used with Juan Jose or
> Juan Francisco. More often I see Jose--Jose David,
> Jose Gabriel, Jose Miguel, etc.  Sometimes I see
> Juan de Dios or Jesus de la Cruz.  Would that last
> one be called just Cruz by his family?  Yet I never
> heard of anyone called just Dios. I have seen people
> named Santiago or Santacruz or just Santos. Maria is
> sometimes Maria de los Santos, or Maria de los
> Dolores, or Maria de Jesus, etc.  I have also
> noticed in the films that all children baptised or
> born on or near a certain day were given the same
> saint's name.  So in a village there might by
> several people with the same saint's name and
> surname, making my search for one particular person
> harder since I have to search then for the parents'
> names or other clues to be sure I am researching the
> right person.  I remember as a small child that
> people would sometimes exclaim, "Jesus, Jose y
> Maria!" when something excited them.
> 
> An example:  My great-great grandmother in Dona Ana
> County, New Mexico was named Maria de Jesus Medina. 
> I found a lady by that name living in 1880 married
> to a Jose Provencio, the name of my great-great
> grandfather. but instead of living in Chamberino NM,
> this couple lived in La Mesilla, about 20 miles
> north, and not in Chamberino where I was told they
> had always lived.  I later finally found the other
> couple, the one I am descended from, living in
> Chamberino at the same time.  The ladies were both
> Maria de Jesus Medina, the men were my great-great
> grandfather Jose Eligio Provencio and the other Jose
> Provencio was Jose Maria Provencio.  It took me
> years to find I was following leads on the wrong
> Maria de Jesus Medina.  I kept wondering why her
> husband kept changing his name from Jose Maria to
> Jose Eligio.
> 
> So, in searching the IGI, if at first I don't find
> someone by the name known to his/her family, I will
> enter as a first name simply Jose, or Maria, or Je.,
> or Jn. or Ma. or Mra. and I find what I am looking
> for.  In the actual records, I do see that
> sometimes, rarely, a person was baptised simply as
> just Jose or Maria.
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Joseph Puentes
> Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 3:53 PM
> To: LosRanchos
> Subject: [ranchos] Juan v. Juan Jose v. Jose
> Francisco
> 
> 
> I'm pondering some first names. I've got a relative,
> Vicente Diaz who had 9 children but in every example
> and in his first wedding his father was listed as
> Jose or Josse Diaz.  
> 
> Now isn't listing a person as Jose Diaz over and
> over again the equivilent of saying that he didn't
> know or remember his name?  
> 
> Or that something was up with the name that he
> didn't want to give it?  Are there examples of
> people in the late 1790's and early 1800's being
> named "Jose" by itself without another name, the
> real name? I know that in later times there are
> examples of just plain "Jose" being used but I'm
> unsure of the used of "Jose" only in the later time
> period.
> 
> okay so then at 62 years of age around 1844 Vicente
> Diaz remarries and lists his father as Juan Jose
> Diaz then he dies around 1849 and his father is
> listed as Juan Diaz.  
> 
> Something is fishy here and I think that Vicente
> really didn't have a good handle on what his
> father's name was. I have a brother of his who also
> listed his father as Jose Diaz over and over again
> but whose father on his marriage certificate is
> listed as Francisco Diaz
> 
> And I found a Jose Francisco Diaz married to
> Concepcion Castaneda (correct name for the spouse of
> Francisco, Juan and Juan Jose in every case) who had
> a Vicente Diaz in the right place (Cuculiten,
> Zacatecas) at the right time.
> 
> so I'm wondering if my Juan Diaz or Juan Jose Diaz
> is really Jose Francisco Diaz.
> 
> I've got other information, indirect as it maybe,
> that lends support to this theory. . . .I sure would
> like a shut and closed case but though there is a
> multitude of records I can't seem to get that door
> closed.  
> 
> Sounds like I"m reaching. . .  
> 
> joseph
> 
> 
> 
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